Our Lord Drank Wine - with due moderation - Not Just Grape Juice

Sandra Balance

Admin ·

Did Jesus Drink Wine Or Grape Juice? My understanding is that it was alcohol. Yall? This post was intended to bring a good "healthy" debate, not to stir up combative behavior towards one another.

I

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Definitely wine.

"Did Jesus Drink Wine Or Grape Juice?"

He probably also drank grape juice during the short period when it was available without refrigeration or pasteurisation.

Like within 2 days or one week from the pressing of the grapes.

I am not sure of the exact limit at which grape juice becomes Federweisser (this is wine not fermented to the end yet, ranging from 4 to 10 % before it settles at a higher percentage and becomes wine).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federweisser

For those who don't know wine cultivating regions, grape juice turns to Federweisser before Federweisser turns to real wine.

II

Christian Davis

Real wine, however it would have been much weaker than modern wines as the fermentation process was not as effective

Rachel Portnoy Bradley

This is historically inaccurate. The fermentation process 2,000 years ago was not "less effective." It is the same process as today. Physics and chemistry work the same today as they did 2,000 years ago.

In fact, today, vitners are able to control the alcoholic content much more easily. The result is, today's wines are ***less*** alcoholic than they were 2,000 years ago, as they can be preserved without being just pure alcohol.

The important thing to note, however, is that this wine was not made by a vitner, but by Jesus Christ. It had not been fermented for days, weeks, or years. It was instantaneous. It was a miracle.

The question you have to ask is, did Jesus make wine, or did he make grape juice?

The other argument one hears from time to time is that there was no Greek word for "grape juice." That is not true, either. There was a way to drink the juice from grapes before it had been fermented, and people knew the difference, in taste, of fermented wine (oinos) and non-fermented grape juice.

If you believe what the gospel writer says, it was wine, because that's what the guests at the wedding said. No one said, "Wow, this is really good grape juice." They would have commented if it didn't taste like fermented wine.

If you believe that we can re-interpret the Gospels to suit our own beliefs, then sure, you can say it was grape soda if you want.

Christian Davis

Rachel Portnoy Bradley The chemistry hasn't changed but our ability to make use of it has changed ,modern fermentation processes are able to produce stronger wines than 2k years ago.And much better beer .

Rachel Portnoy Bradley

Christian Davis this is simply not true. Human biology has not changed that much over 2,000 years. We have not evolved that much. There is scientific evidence that refutes what you're saying. When I'm at my computer again (I'm on my phone right now) I'll post it for you.

Christian Davis

Rachel Portnoy Bradley beer was fermented in the mug u drank it from wine was fermented in vats ,

Jacob Pando

What's wrong with you Rachel? Don't you know that as time goes on, we tend to find better ways of doing things? It is ver possible that we've found ways to make wine have more alcohol given that everyone today is all about getting drunk.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

"modern fermentation processes are able to produce stronger wines than 2k years ago."

Stronger in average, since wines threatening to become weak get added glucose during process.

Wines naturally range from 7 to 12 / 13 %, and this technique eliminates about the lower half of the range.

But even a weak natural wine of 7 % is as strong as a strong beer.

What is true is that wine was usually drunk weaker, insofar as it was customary to mix it with water.

Rachel Portnoy Bradley

Hans-Georg Lundahl I'll buy that for a nickle.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Note also, low glucose is more a problem in Austria than in Holy Land, since sun heat is one of the factors.

Christian Davis "beer was fermented in the mug u drank it from"

Actually no. Beer was in Holy Land at least made by "throwing bread on waters". If you accept Shekar (Strong's Number: 7941) as qualifying as beer, which is reasonable.

Jacob Pando "It is ver possible that we've found ways to make wine have more alcohol given that everyone today is all about getting drunk."

On average, yes, eliminating the lower range of natural alcohol content in wine.

Over upper limit no. You can add wine liquor to stop fermentation and get a sweet strong wine, and it can have like 18% which is impossible with natural fermentation, BUT for that reason it is NOT wine. You cannot celebrate the Eucharist in Port or Sherry Amontillado. You need natural wine, with natural fermentation only (adding glucose before fermentation is allowed).

You can also make simply wine liquor, but no one I know of calls grappa, cognac, armagnac or similar brandies "wine".

Btw, it is more reasonable to translate shekar as beer than as brandy. Except for the purpose of someone wanting to make a nazir vow these days, despite OT being ended by consummation on the Cross.

Jacob Pando

It seems like someone just loves their wine too much to listen to reason. Test the spirit of conversation in Rachel. Repent!

Hans-Georg Lundahl

What is reasonable about bad history, Jacob Pando?

III

Maja Hill

In cultures that drink moderate amounts of wine drinking with meals, alcoholism rates are pretty low. The Bible warns against drunkenness and blesses the proper uses for drinking wine.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Hear, hear!