He Used Geocentrism as Example of a Wrong Scientific Consensus

Not Robert Bennett, he started the thread correctly. But someone else. A new acquaintance.

Robert Bennett

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Principal contributor

Is it really a stumbling block to the Gospel, as OEC's claim, to reject science that is taught as fact in all colleges and universities across the world?

Michael Head

Colleges and universities used to teach the sun revolved around the earth. Was it true just because it was taught somewhere?

Robert Bennett

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Principal contributor

Michael Head it's worse than even that today. They are teaching that men can have babies and that humans evovled over millions of years from ape-like creatures.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Principal contributor

Michael Head What's your exact problem with God turning the Universe around the Earth each day?

Seems to be St. Paul's apologetics for God's existance and qualities in Romans 1.

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and injustice of those men that detain the truth of God in injustice: 19 Because that which is known of God is manifest in them. For God hath manifested it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him, from the creation of the world, are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made; his eternal power also, and divinity: so that they are inexcusable.

He wasn't speaking of the flagellum of the bacteria. Those have not been visible since creation, since microscopes, at least post-Flood, are a fairly recent thing and were not around in the 1st C. AD.

Why "from heaven"? Well, perhaps because we see precisely heaven revolve around us.

Michael Head

Hans-Georg Lundahl reeeealy missing the point….

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Principal contributor

Michael Head "Colleges and universities used to teach the sun revolved around the earth."

OK, you meant it as an ad homines, those who disagree with Geocentrism should look out better next time that someone claims one should go with mainstream science. Right?

Given some Geocentrics are actually on your board, would it not be somewhat more delicate to avoid infighting to take advances we actually agree on, like Harvey proved the pulse was not a movement of air and that blood was not stationary in the body (apart from wounds).

Or did you mean St. Paul's point? I don't think so, prove me wrong, if that's what you meant.

Michael Head

Hans-Georg Lundahl still absolutely missing the point.

And apparently also missing that the Bible doesn’t teach geocentrism.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Principal contributor

Joshua 10:12.

Note. Verse 13 is a description of what happened, it could be construed as phenomenal language.

Verse 12. Joshua first prayed to God and then gave an order to what miraculously stopped. It was not the "rotation of the earth" he adressed.

I think I do have kind of a point in this context. On this issue, you are modernists like OECs. And if your example was meant to adress a mistake they make in a way they could understand, how about using Harvey's blood circulation next time?

Michael Head

Hans-Georg Lundahl I guess you don’t know about the countries that recorded a long night in history, too.

Hans-Georg Lundahl

Principal contributor

Did you take my remark as some kind of doubts on Joshua's long day?

I have calculated the exact geographic point where long day and long night would meet, it was in East China. So, logically some people in China would have had differring opinions on what it was, but the conflict was resolved, those having observed a long night simply went further East, to Japan, perhaps even to the Americas.

No, I am not a scoffer.

I am a Geocentric. Unlike TST, I am not doing publicity stunts to provoke Christians.

If Church Fathers and Scholastics agree that the Earth stands still and it was Sun and Moon that stopped, that's good enough for me. MY suspicions go to the contrary narrative, like how Heliocentrism is supposed to be a proven fact. Especially since a day in 2001 (23rd of August, I noted the following day as St. Bartholomew's Feast), when someone gave me the Distant Starlight Problem ... all the problems start when between December and June or January and July we are supposed to have a known distance involved in the triangle of Earth, Star, one body moving. If Earth moves around the Sun, we do have one known distance, twice the Astronomic Unit, and its end points are two positions of Earth. If Sun moves around the Zodiac, the twice the Astronomic Unit is instead about the Sun, which is not involved in the triangle Earth viewing two positions of the star.

I see no moment in history when Heliocentrism went from unproven to proven. It is still unproven, and it is, worse, against the Bible.

On your view, Joshua spoke on God's behalf to work a miracle, after praying, and expressed himself in a manner confused about what the miracle would involve. Could Jesus have been confused when He "thought He" drove out demons too? No. I believe demons exist, and so I also believe Joshua, inspired after his prayer to God, knew exactly what it was he adressed on the long day.

Especially as Jesus and Joshua, in Hebrew as in Greek, are namesakes:

Yeshua (ha Meshiakh) ~ Yoshua (Ben Nun).
IHCOYC (O XPICTOC) ~ IHCOYC (NAYH).

That's why I referred to verse 12.

Age Difference

AN

14.IV.2024

Those that like to say "Love is love" suddenly change their tune when it's an older guy dating a younger woman.

M

Ummm a) love is love is a dumb concept anyway and b) nothing to do with younger, but how much younger at first meeting. This sounds like a huge cope.

AN

M it's an accurate observation I believe.

HGL

M "how much younger at first meeting."

Why?

M

HGL 18 vs 30 is very different to 25 vs 37. Maturity is why, frontal lobe development is why. Western 18 year olds are also like African 12 year olds so there are cultural elements too.

HGL

Look, frontal lobe is, according to the obvious views of the Church over centuries, sufficiently developed at 12 to chose a spouse.

I suspect it is the same for males -- even if the limit for them was 14.

That higher limit was chosen bc of other organs needed to be in place when starting a marriage.